the article need to update! Please someone update! —The preceding comment was added by 203.81.172.46 (talk • contribs)

This is a wiki, so please plunge forward and help us update it. Vidimian (talk) 15:16, 16 January 2013 (UTC)Reply

This is a summary of the conventions used on Myanmar articles. All are either codified in the Manual of Style or were arrived at by discussion.

Currency: MMKx, i.e., MMK255

Temperature: Celsius

Time: 24-hour clock

Measurements: Metric

Spelling:: British English

Telephone numbers: A Myanmar number should be listed like:

+95 1 234-5678

where "95" is the country code for Myanmar, the next one, two, three or four digits are the area code (no leading zero in international format) and the remaining 6, 7 or 8 digits (conjoined with a hyphen) are the "local" part of the subscriber number.

Seligne (talk) 00:24, 14 February 2014 (UTC)Reply

The only quibble I have is with using the formatting 5,000 kyat rather than MMK5,000 for prices.

Admittedly it's over a year since I've been in Burma and I know that the pace of change is rapid, but when I was there I didn't see "kyat" written much at all and, of course the spelling will mislead a lot of foreigners as to the (rather staccato) pronunciation. However, I do appreciate that you've probably put in a lot of work already in standardising on the exception to using the ISO abbreviation. I do fear that the HTML for the non-breaking space may be problematical for a lot of editors... --118.93nzp (talk) 00:37, 14 February 2014 (UTC)Reply

I have never been to Burma, so I defer to experience. When I first went to the Myanmar articles, the prevailing custom was kyat, so I followed it. My preference is always to go ISO. No problem going to MMK if that is the way to go. Maybe some more Burma travellers can weigh in here. Seligne (talk) 01:00, 14 February 2014 (UTC)Reply

In theory, I'm in favour of as few exceptions as possible to our MoS, since that makes exposition easier and shorter and remembrance more likely. Since you seem to be of a similar mind, I'm going to revert the recent change to wv:$ until we have a clear consensus here to introduce the kyat as an exception. --118.93nzp (talk) 01:27, 14 February 2014 (UTC)Reply

Let's not make kyat an exception. Let's standardise on the ISO nomenclature, MMK, if we can achieve consensus on this or there are no strenuous objections. Seligne (talk) 05:57, 14 February 2014 (UTC)Reply

I think sufficient time has now passed without objections to standardise on the ISO nomenclature, MMK. Would you like to amend your "summary of the conventions used in Myanmar articles" at the head of this sub-section accordingly, Seligne? --118.93nzp (talk) 01:51, 22 March 2014 (UTC)Reply

I object. There is no excuse for even considering the ISO code here; kyat is the obvious choice. If something else is used locally, we can discuss that. Pashley (talk) 09:51, 29 March 2014 (UTC)Reply

Are these all the same river? If so, this needs to be made clear. I think Irrawaddy is still the most-used name in English, so for the description of Ngwe Saung in "Other destinations", this clarification is probably needed: "longest stretch of beach in Ayeyarwaddy (English: Irrawaddy) Division". What do you all think? Ikan Kekek (talk) 23:55, 20 December 2015 (UTC)Reply

Yes. I'd say use Irrawaddy everywhere, but in your example I guess we should include the other spelling if that is what is used officially.

Three Parallel Rivers National Park mentions it as Irrawaddy. Pashley (talk) 15:00, 21 December 2015 (UTC)Reply

Thanks. Edited accordingly. Ikan Kekek (talk) 02:26, 22 December 2015 (UTC)Reply

Just removed this from the "Teahouses" section: "If you are not sure simply ask for the Lapae yeah zein. " Is that asking for the menu, whether they have food, whether they have noodles or what? I can't find any of the words in our Burmese phrasebook either. If someone puts back the sentence in the article, please do add an English translation. ϒpsilon (talk) 08:16, 14 May 2016 (UTC)Reply

I would guess that "Lapae yeah zein" is a phonetic transcription rather than actual romanized words. Google Translate doesn't recognize them as Burmese, but they could be romanized idiosyncratically. Powers ^(talk) 21:12, 23 May 2016 (UTC)Reply

Right now, there are 10 listed. The maximum is supposed to be 9, per Wikivoyage:Avoid long lists. Which one should be removed? Ikan Kekek (talk) 11:18, 25 August 2017 (UTC)Reply

Where do we want to put these? In a warningbox on this page and relevant region pages, in "Stay Safe" or where?

https://travel.gc.ca/destinations/burma-myanmar

http://smartraveller.gov.au/Countries/asia/south-east/Pages/myanmar.aspx

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/burma

Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:57, 15 September 2017 (UTC)Reply

Map of Archive 2013–2022

To the right is the map with all Wikidata items for the districts. This should simplify the work in case editors want to create mapmasks for the region articles. The tool Wikidata Extractor has been used to create the mapshapes.--Renek78 (talk) 12:30, 24 November 2018 (UTC)Reply

I am planning a run through North-east India, into Myanmar via Manipur and out into Thailand

There seems to be a serious deficit of reliable and current information, and since it is critical to over-landers not entering china I believe this should be a priority. (self interest aside)

The official Government tourism page is incomplete at best and of dubious credibility http://tourism.gov.mm/information/permitted-area/ Take a look at "chin state" for instance, is travel in the whole state forbidden; or permitted? The one border to india passes through it and a 80$ permit just to get to Mandalay would really dent some peoples plans.

And I think we need to really evaluate claims that go contrary to the government sources, like "being able to enter from Myanmar and leave into Thailand", because these are time-sensitive reports I think we need to date such claims

--Billbarrelrider (talk) 13:53, 28 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

You are absolutely encouraged to date potentially unreliable information like this, especially if you find your experience on the ground differs from what either we or the Myanmar government have published. --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 15:23, 28 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

Actually, it may even warrant a caution box. What do you think, Will? --ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 15:24, 28 January 2019 (UTC)Reply

It seems like visa conditions have relaxed considerably, but I'm holding off on making edits until I can find official or verifiable sources as it is a sensetive area and misinformation abounds.

For instance I got an evisa yesterday for tamu and only yesterday a fellow traveller told me that they were told at the Delhi embassy they needed some "land visa". The possibility of crossing from Thailand to India and vice versa is another issue. Some guides still have printed that an outgoing flight ticket is required when entering by land.

I can report what I've experienced, but that's hardly a solid enough guarantee.

I think we have to scour and screenshot the Myanmar governments website for official information, I've personally emailed them requesting clarification on the possibility of visa runs from India and a few other minor points. We may have to also specifically refute false and outdated information so our users aren't confused.

I would advocate using the format "in (insert date) many travellers report being allowed to (whatever they did) if we can't get official information, to not fall into the trap of guaranteeing anything is possible just because it's common

Billbarrelrider (talk) 18:36, 19 April 2019 (UTC)Reply

Thank you user 203.81.71.22 for your very helpfull edit on getting myanmar visas in Delhi.

generally directions to an embassy are placed in the article for the city which the embassy is located in eg. (Delhi), not in the article of the country for which you are applying for a visa (Myanmar). This is simply because there are so many embassies, listing directions for every embassy in the world would take up too much space. I would like to move your directions to the embassy to the Delhi article in the "cope" section, because they are usefull for everyone trying to find the Myanmar embassy in Delhi.

Your instruction will help many people, thank you.

---Billbarrelrider (talk) 10:04, 19 May 2019 (UTC)Reply

I moved all the embassy specific advices to the relevant embassies and referenced them in the Myanmar article. I reckon, we are aeons away from WV embassy articles to be overly excessive and the ones being so are for a reason, because many people are interested in these procedures, like getting into Myanmar from India or Thailand. So, I am happy to have them exactly there. Cope is too general to be found by traveller.

Cheers Ceever (talk) 13:03, 20 May 2019 (UTC)Reply

I agree with Billbarrelrider. You may be right about "Cope" being too general for the average reader to find it, though. I think the place to discuss that is probably Wikivoyage talk:Section headers. Ikan Kekek (talk) 15:37, 20 May 2019 (UTC)Reply

I'm glad for your responses, There are several considerations here And more opinions are important. While In this instance it's less important-but I've noticed "get in" is becoming increasingly lengthy regarding embassies.

put simply, I can get an English visa in a hundred countries, and listing directions to all of them on England's "get in" wouldn't be ideal.

since directions to embassies apply regardless of which Visa you are applying for I vote we put directiOns to embassies in the city the embassy is in —The preceding comment was added by Billbarrelrider (talk • contribs)

I agree with your well-stated argument. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:06, 21 May 2019 (UTC)Reply

Should this article discuss units of measurement? Metric and Imperial equivalents briefly mentions that Myanmar has its own units, and w:Myanmar units of measurement gives conversions. —Granger (talk · contribs) 02:49, 20 July 2019 (UTC)Reply

I think it's definitely mentioning under "buy" that Myanmar does not use the metric system and many Myanmar people will not even know what a "kilo" or a "gram" is- unless they are dealing in precious minerals. -Bill /3/07/2020

Below is a proposed infobox to let readers know which formatting conventions to use in Wikivoyage articles. Do you agree with these proposals? If you have direct knowledge of what is most commonly used in the country, please let us know. Ground Zero (talk) 19:50, 6 December 2019 (UTC)Reply

Moved to the top of this page. Ground Zero (talk) 04:37, 28 December 2019 (UTC)Reply

I am concerned that the "buy" section has become confusing, too much information is repeated in the different sections, some of the advice is outdated/missing and too much information is given about previous/obsolete practices/history. While I am sure this information is of interest to many people it is likely to be confusing to those seeking practical advice.

I lived in Myanmar for some time and as a long-time wiki editor and I would be prepared to re-do this section, but since issues relating to money are sensitive I thought I should seek some consensus. --101.173.156.95 07:46, 3 July 2020 (UTC) (Bill_Barrel_Rider)Reply

I hope you would update! Lay out whatever you think could be sensitive here, so we can discuss it. Ikan Kekek (talk) 08:05, 3 July 2020 (UTC)Reply

Hi guys, I took the liberty to consolidate the information and remove duplication. However, @OP ... feel free to update the information and remove outdated stuff. Try to stick to the chaptering, so travellers are able to distinguish between the specific subtopics. Cheers Ceever (talk) 14:51, 4 July 2020 (UTC)Reply

Swept in from the pub

In recent months, there is a surge of human trafficking reported in Cambodia, Myanmar and Thailand, where travellers (mainly Taiwanese travellers, Chinese travellers were more common pre-COVID) were tricked by fake job offers, travelled to and abducted in these countries, and forced to work for criminal syndicates like slaves. In response to the trend, I have issued warnings for articles of Cambodia (particularly Sihanoukville), Myanmar (particularly Northern Myanmar) and Thailand.

References (all in Chinese):

• w:zh:柬埔寨人口販賣事件, the article recording the surge on Chinese Wikipedia.
• Travel warning (highest level) for Cambodia, issued by Taiwanese MFA.
• Information page by the Taiwanese MFA.
• News report by Taiwanese investigative journalist The Reporter, covering the background of the surge and involvement of local Taiwanese gangs.
• News report by Hong Kong newspaper am730.
• News report by Hong Kong newspaper Ming Pao, illustrating the death of a victim.
• News report by Hong Kong newspaper Ming Pao highlighting Hong Kong travellers have also fallen into victim, luckily most of them are successfully rescued.
• News report (in English) by The Diplomat, illustrating the seriousness of the trend.

Please check if there are problems of over-bolding or other grammatical problems, and feel free to add more on advices if necessary.廣九直通車 (talk) 06:41, 17 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

Thank you, that's a good addition (the warnings are in 'Work', for anyone else interested). If you haven't already done so, it might be a good idea to add these to zh.wikivoyage.--ThunderingTyphoons! (talk) 07:05, 17 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

This seems horrendous and frightful should definitely be mentioned. Thanks for adding them 廣九直通車. Agree with tt! that it might be a good idea to add this to zh.voy. SHB2000 (talk | contribs | meta) 11:31, 17 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

Thanks. I'll keep on my sentry work, just like how I made my first warning on COVID for Wuhan (sigh it's almost 2 years and the pandemic still doesn't come to an end...). Will follow up on Chinese Wikivoyage.廣九直通車 (talk) 11:36, 17 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

@SHB2000, ThunderingTyphoons!: While the entire Chinese Wikivoyage is mostly empty (that's why I'm more focused in here), I've also Done with the warnings at there: see voy:zh:柬埔寨, voy:zh:泰国, voy:zh:緬甸 and voy:zh:西哈努克. Perhaps after there are no further comments, this thread should be swept to the corresponding article talk pages.廣九直通車 (talk) 13:27, 17 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

We do have some cautionary info at Working_abroad#Stay_safe, Common_scams#Employment_and_charity_scams and Volunteer_travel#Be_wary. I wonder if those need to be expanded or if some links should be added either in this article or in those.

Certainly variations on the problem are fairly widespread. In my own travels I've encountered:

• • Filipinas trapped in exploitive jobs in Saudi Arabia (1980s, not sure if it still happens). She cannot leave the country without an exit visa and getting that requires the boss's signature. He says she's a lazy bitch & he's not signing. She says he beat or raped her, often both. My advice would be don't go anywhere where you'd need an exit visa to leave.
  • An agency charging Chinese nurses large up-front fees for placements in Canada on domestic servant visas taking care of disabled people, mostly Alzheimer's patients. Salary might have sounded good to a Chinese, but it was much less than you'd get working at McDonald's and hours were much longer.

Things I've only heard about include an Indian diplomat in the US mistreating domestic help (w:Devyani Khobragade incident), Fujian girls being smuggled to Taipei being thrown overboard when the Taiwan Coast Guard caught the boats , Snakehead gangs importing prostitutes to the US. Pashley (talk) 14:56, 17 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

Here pickers of wild berries are imported from e.g. south-east Asia. They often have to take loans for the journey. The buyers of the berries arrange visa, travel, accommodation, intro, transport to the woods etc., but usually do not employ them. One year the harvest was weak and the pickers couldn't pay the loans. Volunteers helped them go to court to claim employment, but the pickers couldn't afford to stay during the multiple-year process, so they settled at terms they could live with. The berry-pickers are still not regarded employees, but to get visas for their labour, the buyers now need to guarantee a minimum income (and there are more eyes on lodgings, rents etc.). We have also had a number of outright illegal arrangements, mainly in other trades. The common denominator seems to be loans and threat of being expelled from the country for illegal work, in the cases where it isn't about direct slavery. For those who have an income at home, the risk of being expelled isn't a reason to remain in slavery, but if you have family you cannot feed without the foreign income ... The criminals may also threaten you and your family in your country of origin, especially if the justice is weak there. –LPfi (talk) 20:16, 18 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

I support these warnings. Last night I added caution boxes to Tachileik and Myawaddy on the same issue. And it is not just targetting individuals who speak Chinese. Malaysian and Indonesian were also targetted by the same group of fraudsters. This merits posting in English to reach as wide audience as possible. I do not think this is the typical "run of the mills" employment scams since those commons scams only want your money. The current scam hold you hostage and force you to work for them. OhanaUnited^{Talk page} 01:30, 19 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

I appreciate these kinds of warnings. They are important. Ikan Kekek (talk) 06:54, 19 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

Update: It seems that not only aspirant workers are falling victim, criminals are also targeting the average travellers. Some may recruit workers in local front companies and traffic victims en masse using company tours, others may use individualized vacation invitation to lure them to these countries (see this report by HK TV Channel i-Cable), all followed up by abduction. I genuinely don't know when will the criminals resort to random abduction if the situation worsens. Given by such worrying scenario, I have raised the warnings to the top of all these articles. Please advice if this is appropriate or they should be send back to stay safe, regards.廣九直通車 (talk) 11:42, 19 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

Also thanks to OhanaUnited for leaving proper warning, have upgraded these warnings to {{warningbox}}based on the template's usage guidelines.廣九直通車 (talk) 13:40, 19 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

I read that Laos may also be one of the destinations. I propose adding the same warning to Laos. OhanaUnited^{Talk page} 22:15, 19 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

The warningbox at the top of the article should be very brief. Most of the information could be in Work (not necessarily in a warning box), that relevant also for those not intending to find work in Stay safe. Some of this should probably be in Working abroad and Common scams. –LPfi (talk) 06:36, 20 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

Thanks for Mx. Granger's and your opinion. I have send these warnings back to "Work" and "Stay safe" (if work is not yet created). Though do you think a very brief warning on the top with link to the more detailed warning is OK?廣九直通車 (talk) 04:16, 24 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

The warning starts with: Telecommunication fraud, illegal remote gambling are rampant in parts of Thailand and its neighbours, Myanmar and Cambodia. How does this relate to te rest of the info in the warning box? --FredTC (talk) 06:02, 24 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

@FredTC: You mean the warning for Thailand? I make special remark on Cambodia and Myanmar, because Thailand is a major transit hub for human traffickers to transit victims from their country to their bases in Cambodia and Myanmar, though criminal bases do exist in Thailand (like the notorious "KK園區", not sure what's its English name). The remainder of the warning focus on common methods used by human traffickers and ways to avoid them. If you have concerns about coherence, please make your point clearer, thank you.廣九直通車 (talk) 09:43, 24 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

I mean the "Telecommunication fraud, illegal remote gambling" -part of the text. FredTC (talk) 09:58, 24 August 2022 (UTC)Reply

For that part I tried to lay down the context and background. After all, criminals don't traffic and abduct victims for no reason, they do these because they need to recruit manpower for them.廣九直通車 (talk) 03:16, 26 August 2022 (UTC)Reply